AppGyver community dead? Support? Chat?


#1

I can’t find a Gitter, Slack, IRC or any kind of active chat medium for AppGyver/Steroids/Supersonic.
Does anyone know of any?

The devs don’t seem to reply to forum posts, or are selective with what they reply to.

With undocumented APIs and other issues, I’d have thought active support or chat medium would have been essential.

I love AppGyver but these issues are making it difficult to commit to.


#2

Sorry for the silence! We’re currently working super hard on a new product release, so that’s stretching our resources on how much we are able to provide free support here or prioritize certain fixes. That said, we are committed to keeping the product running, so if existing things break down, we will fix them.

After things stabilize, we will get on top of improving the API and other documentation, as well getting the whole dev side of our platform really breathing again. We will also look into better ways to provide timely support.

Let me know if you have any more questions.


#3

Thanks for your response. What is the estimated date for this new product release? Is there any information on this new release?


#4

Guys, while you’re working on new product features, which is all nice of course, what about the people who are actually using Appgyver right now? You are definitely loosing a lot of existing and potentially new dev users.

I’m sticking to Appgyver for now, but just because we’ve already committed a lot of hours & resources and product looks 90% finished. Still struggling to come up with workarounds for all the inconsistencies and unexpected behaviors though. And the lack of thorough documentation or some kind of slack/IRC type of real-time channel of communication adds to the frustration quite a lot.

I’d think “dev site” of your platform is who your ultimate clients are. If so, we’re pretty unhappy right now.


#5

AppGyver is dead. And not only its dead the big issue is that they are not fixing reported bugs I’m afraid that steroids framework is useless now because they want to release Composer 2 and tools like that for beginners and casual developers. It’s really a pity :sweat:


#6

We’re not dead in the sense that nothing’s happening – there’s 18 people working full-time on the platform. Two new guys just joined three weeks back. Multiple apps are being submitted to the App Store and Google Play by our users every week (even if it’s sometimes a struggle).

That said, we do realize that we haven’t been doing a good job recently at updating Steroids/Supersonic, fixing annoying bugs, keeping the docs in premium condition or even attending the community forums. The community/docs/user engagement is something I’m head of, and I apologize for the frustration – there’s just a lot on the table as we move to expand our offering beyond the free HTML5 developer framework.

The core audience of Composer 2 is not beginners/casual developers, it’s businesses looking to streamline/automate their processes, get better access to data and more. With more paying customers using the AppGyver platform, we’ll have more resources to allocate to fixing the free-to-use developer tools, too.

So even though we’ve been focusing on tackling the enterprise/business app market now with Composer 2, keeping Steroids/Supersonic alive and evolving is still on our agenda. We will be fixing the bugs in existing features – for example, https://github.com/AppGyver/steroids/issues/570 was just fixed in latest edge release, and @Fido68’s epic drawer ghost WebView fix is on the backlog now that we finally got what the problem was, just not #1 as we gear for launch.

We will also do an overhaul/gothrough of the Supersonic documentation and make all the new Composer 2 middleware capabilities (data proxy, cloud code, automation engine, users/auth etc) available for use in built-from-scratch Supersonic apps, too.

I know promises don’t do much to alleviate your current pains, but I just want to emphasize that we’re not dead and we’re not abandoning Supersonic/Steroids.


#7

Thanks for your response. Good to hear it’s all still active,. Perhaps more regular blog posts to explain what’s happening behind the curtains would help.

Is there a rough ETA on this release?


#8

We’re pushing for this week, actually – stay tuned! Our CEO is also writing a blog post that will talk about the current status and future plans in more detail, so hopefully that will clear things up more.


#9

@Harri_Sarsa I came here to basically make a similar post. I worked on a supersonic project that started virtually the week you launched supersonic (early Dec 2014), there was obviously a lot wrong / not working right because it was new, which I was willing to overlook.

That was nearly a year ago, and having had some time away, recently I have come back and I have to say I am really disappointed by the ‘progress’ or lack there of. There are hundreds of outstanding issues documented in github, with most hardly even responded to, let alone resolved.

I understand you are a business and have to work on the new / exciting things that will gain investment, but to me it feels like you release something, make some token effort to keep it running, then move onto the next thing. This has clearly happened to supersonic, will probably happen to composer 2, etc. With a team of 18, surely it would make sense to have at least a portion of those resources dedicated to existing frameworks and issues with those, rather than just ignoring them for the better part of a year :frowning:

Its just frustrating because there really is a lot of potential with appgyver, but you are diluting your offering and not concentrating on making a great product, with a solid community and base of active developers.


#10

Yup, I really understand how it looks – that’s how it’s been in the past. While we’ve done some updates to Supersonic, Wrapper, Steroids etc. after the launch of Supersonic, the effort is lacking, and we know it.

I can’t do much more than promise that Composer 2 is really the starting point of bringing in everything in the platform together (e.g. after Composer 2 matches Composer 1 feature-wise, which should be before the end of the year, we’ll sunset Composer 1 so we have less to manage). It’s been a huge development effort even with this many people on board, and I know Composer 2 is for the most part catering to a different audience, so it’s no magic bullet for your current projects.

There are plans to get out of the current situation where we can’t give enough attention to the dev community, but I guess the only real thing we can do to regain the trust is just execute harder so we get to put those plans in action and prove ourselves. Sorry for that, and thanks for bringing this up in discussion.


#11

In that case I think its really important to make your plans as open and transparent as possible. The only way to regain the trust and commitment of this community is action. I don’t mean to sound harsh, but words are cheap.

I lose count of how many github issues, and threads on here I have seen where its stated that there are plans to do this or that, which is great. But unless we have visibility on those plans and a roadmap, based on some rough eta, regular updates, or even how likely it is those plans will actually come off, its just showing the lack of commitment to certain projects. And this makes me sad :frowning:


#12

Yup, I agree – I know there’s been way too much of planned this and upcoming that and on the roadmap, and it’s no excuse either that we’re still a startup with many things in flux. Should’ve done a better job and should do a better job at communicating things and being transparent, and we do realize that the trust is eroding.

With that in mind, I won’t push out any more empty words; I think we’ve made clear our intention and all that’s left is to deliver. And as I said, the feedback is valued, so do keep the heat on us!


#13

Ok cool, well i look forward to seeing these intentions in action.

Thanks for the candid responses!


#14

Any updates on this @Harri_Sarsa?


#15

Thanks for pinging me on this.

We’re still working mainly on tightening our focus with Composer 2, improving the core experience there and getting the inbound funnel running better. Since Steroids remains a free tool, we have to focus our efforts on where the revenue is. We would like to be moving faster too, naturally, so we would have resources to really get Steroids/Supersonic back on track – they really are core components in the Composer 2 story, since no other visual app builder tool supports this level of extensibility with HTML5. It’s not a completely divergent path – Composer 2 apps are and will remain Supersonic/Steroids apps – but it does mean making hard decisions on what to fix next, with the community grievances on one hand and Composer 2 business cases on the other hand. I can’t unfortunately make any promises apart from continuing to work on transparency, but the quest for becoming the best and fastest-to-deliver HTML5-based hybrid app development suite/platform is still on.


#16

I feel the same frustration as Chris and probably as many other developers here. Since last summer I have faced several important issues such as default contact plugin leading to crashes on iOS, Android manifest adjustPan not working, very unstable access to any backend db, plus several other issues for which I managed to find some not so satisfying workarounds. These key issues are now the main elements blocking the release of 2 apps and the frustration also propagates to my clients and partners. On the other hand several other hybrid apps development platforms start to gain in popularity and their performance and support reviews are quite good. I can understand your business priorities and probably your equal disastifaction with all this but with no single reply to our issues for months and no clear ETA for when your support will be back to normal you can probably also understand that many devs will also start migrating to other platforms, which is a shame not only for all the time and efforts wasted but also because I believed AppGyver had great potential. Composer 2 seems to still have loads of features to be finalized so my guess is that we won’t see any solid support for another few months…


#17

Exactly my feeling @Mathias_Bonnet ! I definitely wouldn’t recommend the use of Appgyver at the moment!! As it was much better (years?) ago I build up a large App on it but am now stuck on different points and missing updates of plugins. I really would love to switch to plain Ionic + Cordova but it would be to much work atm.

As the whole Supersonic/Steroids Platform seems to be the base for composer and other important products I cannot understand why they don’t pay attention to this important part.

Guys, IF maybe this part (steroids/supersonic) isn’t that important anymore in the future for your strategy let us know so we don’t wait and switch to something else…


#18

I think you guys have it All wrong . let me explain.

If you focus on making better the core of steroids And supersonic you will be able to finish a great product. As soon as you do that you focus entirely on building prebuild apps or modules you can sale but more important a marketplace.

You can check how many have done this like Prestashop , magento , WordPress and in your industry ionic wich people don’t like to use and that is the reason why they want more much appgyver.

So you need to really see that you have lost time many time trying to monetize through composer and not the gold mine you have with steroids and supersonic.

You have already built a community , just make a marketplace and you guys build apps and modules for that marketplace. You can monetize much more faster like that .

Sale if you want a module for dreamfactory don’t give it free. Sale it for 50 I will pay for it and sell many other things like templates , social login , shopping carts integration , you name it you can make a lot of money from this.

I have a big marketplace on my country if you like I could guide you through this and be part of the project but I see on appgyver a sad story of a company that has lost it’s main focus when they were at the line of making money. Appgyver team just did not see the opportunity and preferr fast money.

Business apps? Come on guys , that kind of apps are easy to build and company’s have a lot of money to pay for them , point to a bigger audience as us the devs and entering level devs and sale sale sale through a marketplace .

Have you seen codecanyon, themeforest etc? You need to do this and stop wasting time on other things .

I expect a reply as complete as possible to see if you got my suggestion or explanation telling me why you think I’m wrong.


#19

Thanks for voicing your thoughts. We realize that the core Steroids/Supersonic experience has not received much love in the past months, and we apologize for that. It’s been a matter of focus, and we’ve been super busy working to get all the pieces together for a big announcement. It will provide a way forward regarding many of the problems mentioned. There’s been a few delays, but I’m hopeful we’ll have something to share soon.

We will be opening up the rationale for focusing on internal enterprise apps – it’s a huge topic to cover, but to give a short answer, the @Daniel3’s point about business apps “being easy to build” and companies having “a lot of money to pay for them” is just not true.

Business-critical apps have a LOT of moving parts: security on all levels, users and ACL, data connectors, backend logic, automation… In addition, enterprises globally are struggling to meet growing mobile app backlogs – Gartner estimates that in a few years, demand for internal business apps will be 5x greater than the ability to deliver. And that is even with enterprises having growing internal dev teams and increasing their expenditure on outsourced mobile app projects.

At the same time, the app store consumer app space is more competitive than ever, and there’s a lot of focus on flashy UI/UX – something 100% native code has always done better than hybrid apps. We believe there’s huge untapped opportunity in business apps, and we want to help you guys benefit from that.

It’s clear that new, even faster tools are needed to help enterprises deliver, and that’s why we believe in Composer. Thought it might seem like we’re building a dumbed-down visual tool that will never make apps as great as you can code with Steroids/Supersonic, that’s not true – there’s a lot going on under the hood and upcoming in the pipeline. We are still very much focused on developers as the core audience, and extendability through code is one of the key differentiators of Composer compared to other visual builders. There’s exciting stuff coming up.

I’m sorry to be repeating the same mantra of “we’ll soon tell more”, but I hope you’ll stick around to hear what we’ll be next bringing to the community. I can’t give a date for the announcement yet, but it should be soon enough.


#20

April 5th 2016. That was the day the music died :frowning:

She’s dead Jim…

Silly quotes aside, this seems to be a pattern. People moan, appgyver say ‘guys don’t worry, something happening soon’, and then nothing for months.

People are planting their flags in your ecosystem, and it just feels like you don’t want it. As a developer, by backing such a framework we are investing our time, reputation, and in extreme cases our careers on the ability to work through solutions with your platform.

Business critical apps may be the next big thing, but these apps built by non techies won’t be, and you are jeopardising what you already have, a now diminishing community of developers to chase a very questionable business strategy.

I will check in here from time to time, and I am hoping I am wrong, but I’m headed for the life boats, time to jump ship.